The Human Layer
The Human Layer is a podcast for those who refuse to be optimized, for the builders and breakers at the intersection of emergent technology, political resistance, and the fight for a positive-sum future.
The Human Layer
From Token to Trust: How Aya is Reshaping Crypto's Global Impact
Hope isn't just an abstract concept – it's the fuel propelling blockchain innovation across Africa. In this candid conversation with Eric and Michael from Aya, we explore how they're building something extraordinary: the human layer of blockchain technology.
While much of the Western world treats blockchain as a speculative casino, Aya demonstrates how this technology addresses fundamental needs across Africa. From creating stablecoin solutions that protect small businesses from 60% currency devaluation to establishing permanent builder spaces where ideas flourish through random conversations, their approach centers humans rather than tokens.
"Blockchain doesn't ask you where you're from," Eric explains, highlighting how the technology can transcend barriers when properly applied. Through their builder hubs in Ghana and Kenya (with more coming to South Africa and Nigeria), they've incubated 25+ projects that solve real problems for real people. One such project has already attracted 80,000 users with minimal funding – proving that when blockchain meets genuine human needs, adoption follows naturally.
Michael challenges the industry to reconnect with its foundational purpose: "We've built this ecosystem, but we've not actually figured out how to build a solid ecosystem that is totally independent and decentralized." His philosophy of human layer, human coordination, and human flourishing offers a pathway for the entire Web3 ecosystem to evolve beyond speculative hype.
Ready to experience blockchain's transformative potential firsthand? Join Eric and Michael at ZuAfrique, their 21-day popup experience in Kilifi, Kenya this April, where global protocols can witness how technology and humanity intersect to create meaningful change.
Welcome back to the Human Layer podcast, and we are honored and excited to have our guests today from AYA, and I am going to let Eric and Michael introduce themselves, because I feel like y'all could do a much better job.
Speaker 2:Eric, how are you doing? Yeah Well, gm, gm to the community in Denver, the village king. So my name is Eric, I'm an African and my state is Ghana, and I'm building the human layer on top of the blockchain technology, which we all love. And this is my second time in Denver. My first time was last year.
Speaker 2:There was a lot of bubble, a lot of people, but today it feels like I don't know if people are tired or something. I don't see the energy, as I saw last year, and that gave me a kind of validation in terms of what we're building in AYA, in terms of what we're building in AYA, in terms of what we in terms of human layer. But I think, after 15 years of the technology, people are getting to feel like it's the same thing we hear every year and it's nothing new. And so how do we shape perspective? And that's what we bring to the table that this technology is amazing, but you don't see its very effectiveness if you're in this part of the world. Because you don't see its very effectiveness if you're in this part of the world Because you don't see that it will solve problems beyond the token, beyond the ETF, beyond the casino.
Speaker 2:But if you move towards the South American part of the world, africa, you realize, oh, this technology actually is not just a jargon, a buzzword. It's something that really really goes deep into the fiber and everyday life of human beings, and so that's what we believe this conversation is about. The Himalayas are all about bringing the technology in front of human beings and making human beings sit on top of it and using it in their daily life to solve a need instead of a want or a nice-to-have thing. Nice to be here. Thank you for inviting us.
Speaker 1:Oh, my pleasure. I love the way you just said. All of that we're going to dive deep into that Absolutely.
Speaker 2:My name is Michael Awam. My name is Michael Awam. I want to consider myself a philosopher. I've been in the Web3 space since 2014. And I've been in the Web3 space since 2014. I've been the silent voice of reasoning that just kind of hibernates in the back end of everything and just watching all the madness and the bullshit goes on and on. I was privileged to be part of the project called PondX in 2017, where we raised $2 million, so I've been here through all the cycles and bubbles. Happy to be here, I'm happy to lend a voice to what we strongly believe at. Hire is the next global conversation for Web3 if we truly want to move forward as an industry globally.
Speaker 1:Nice, love that.
Speaker 3:I am moving beyond the casino. I love it.
Speaker 1:No, that's fantastic, so let's dive into it. Then. You kind of already touched on the IAM mission in your introduction there, eric, so is there anything you want to follow up with that? And then I'm going to take us into the Hacker House, because I think that when I first let me a little more context, when I first going to take us into the hacker house, because I think that when I first let me a little more context, when I first met y'all, I was working.
Speaker 1:I just started at consensus and as the director of community. So we were building community and we set up a call and I thought it was just going to be like one or two and then your whole team rolled up in there and it was just me and I was like, oh, they are not messing. And that's what I love about y'all, like your passion leaps through whatever mechanism we're talking through and that has stayed consistent. And what you just said about our ecosystem is so spot on and we're feeling it in this country right now. But I love turning to Africa and to South America to see it Like that's. All I have to do is point people who don't understand what our tech is. I point them to what y'all are building and it instantly clicks. There's no need to explain the fuck all this tech is. You're just seeing the real impact on the ground.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so a bit of a background. Why Aya? So in 2017, I got into the space in 2016 through a referral and instantly I saw oh my goodness, for the first time as an adult, I saw a technology that solves my personal problem, even though I got hacked, I got scammed. I didn't understand the technology initially, so the initial entry was through Ponzi scheme and I was excited because it could make you money. But first, you know, I read oh, that was a wrong entry, but the technology was so fascinating because it solves real need. So today, paper is normal for an American average American it's not normal for me. As a Ghanaian, I can't use paper, and seeing Bitcoin able to enable people to send money across without you being asked where you're from for me was an instant belief system and so fast forward. I co-founded a project called QBTEX, which was one of the first wallets built on Stellar blockchain, and what we did was to tokenize local currencies. So today, stablecoins are everywhere. In 2018, we tokenized the Naira, tokenized the Ghana City and we piloted over a million dollars without marketing on Stellar. I remember in 2019, stellar. I remember in 2019, stellar first global conference in Mexico City for Meridian. Second to fourth. I'm giving this receipt to show where we're coming from and why we are doing what we are doing in AYA today.
Speaker 2:Fast forward, kibitess became a success. We moved to about 17 countries. We had teams across the continent and it failed. It failed on two key things. Number one was either people didn't understand what we tried to do with the vision and the team had misalignment, so it failed. And so I picked the misalignment with the team at the time to say how much, how many founders in the world have the same problem that I face with Qubitex, because Qubitex would have been a billion dollar company today. Qubitex, even before Binance came to Africa, qubitex was and I remember having a conversation with Binance in 2019 where Binance wanted us to be their proxy to Africa. They wanted to put money on the table, but my co-founder there didn't see the vision, so he kicked against that. Then Binance went behind us and then I mean, came through the continent anyway. I don't want to go into that, but fast forward, it failed, but the lessons of Kubernetes was what enabled us.
Speaker 2:Okay, there are a lot of founders like me who is not a technical founder. I have a lot of vision, ideas that could turn to a million-dollar idea how do we solve that problem for a lot of founders, and that's what AYA came. And so AYA is not just a name, aya is a movement. Aya means resilience and resourcefulness in my local language. So AYA is not just a company name, it's an ideology, ideology that has lived more than a thousand years. But then I started to have a system called the Adinkra system. The Adinkra system, aya is one of the symbols and it reflects our identity. So it was an idea that came through, a vision, a dream, and we tried to build. So it was an idea that came through a vision, a dream, and we tried to build.
Speaker 2:So the goal for IA was to how do you build trust for African talents to enable them to be able to connect with you without asking them where you're from? Because I believe that blockchain does not ask you where you're from. It's about value. How do you bring that idea of the technology into real human form? And so the first idea for us was to just build a platform for people to have jobs and build that trust. We did that. It was a success, but we realized that, oh, there were not enough talent in the continent who have the right mentality, the right skill set to meet the global demand. Because it's not about pity, it's not about, oh, because I'm African, employ me. No, it's about value. So, fast forward. We shaped our approach and then we got Coinbase to give us our first grant. So, thanks to Coinbase, I mean every day we had the story. I say, if Coinbase did not believe in the train of talent in the initial stages, maybe AYA wouldn't have been here, and that gave us a lot of insights. We trained over 200 people. We had over 10,000 people apply to want to get the skill. But fast forward, okay, the training is great. We have so much people seeing the potential blockchain beyond the token.
Speaker 2:And so two years ago there was Zuzalo and I happened to be there, and not by because I'm African, because I was building something and somebody had seen value and I got invited to be in Zuzalo. It was Zuzalo that stayed with Vitalik, like Ben Jones of Opie, liam of Opie, I mean now with WorldCoin and other colleagues. I see them do some magical stuff through conversation and happy because people were together. But we didn't have that. Aya was built virtually.
Speaker 2:Then I said, oh, africans actually do well by coming together. We are communal people. How do we bring this kind of concept into Africa. That's how we made a change in our approach. Then, two years ago, nobody was talking about African builders because they were starting like African builders, but nobody believed in African builders.
Speaker 2:So the insight from Zuzalo helped us start shaping the conversation in Africa, the narrative, start talking about African builders. We need to move from just skills training to actually making people see a need. Because you go to platform, you speak oh, africa is where the blockchain is needed. And yet you cannot pinpoint any valuable project that is being built from Africa. That was a shame to me. So how do you convince Crystal that, crystal, this technology will not work for you in Denver. It will work for me, but I cannot tell Crystal that actually, this is the solution that we have built. That's what pushed AYA beyond the training to say, okay, now let's actually work on getting more young people to solve problems using technology, and that's where the story has come today.
Speaker 2:So that was inspired from Zuzalo and 18 months later on, we have shaped the continent, and to the higher. It's defining the future of blockchain innovation in Africa, and we are proud about that because it's been hard work, consistency, perseverance and the greats Without any resources. We believe in the mission because we believe that for the world to actually see the beauty of blockchain technology, beyond the buzzwords, we have the best tech. No, it doesn't make sense to us. It's actually showing that this technology actually solves problems by simple tools savings, able to move money around, able to solve data identity, and we have seen that happening. And today we have over 25 projects that we incubated, working directly with LISC and L2 on the super chain, and in the last seven months, the result is amazing.
Speaker 2:Crystal, one of our companies, has over 80,000 users today. They just raised $100,000. Imagine such a project in Silicon Valley with 100,000 users. They would have raised $10 million today. But it's an African project Just $100,000 and they are doing amazing work. Imagine a million-dollar investment into that company. It's called Socazim. It's the first AI-predicting platform built on LIS and doing great things.
Speaker 2:So for us at AYA, it's less of incentive. It's more of how do we actually use this technology to solve real human problems, and that's what the human layer comes in. So the human layer is not just about human people. No, it's about the fact that this technology is a need in the part of the world I come from. Now we want to show you that it's not just saying that. It's a need that people are actually using this technology to solve real problems.
Speaker 2:One example is stablecoin. Stablecoin concept in 2017 was just to peg against Bitcoin. There was no other use case. Africa showed the world that, oh, now we have opportunity to actually convert our local currency, which have high inflationary, to actually convert our local currency, which have high inflationary and reduce our income to actually mortgage and hedging. The world has seen first utility on the blockchain is stablecoin, and Africa has shown the world its utility, its applicability, its impact and everybody stands by the thought of stablecoin and for us it's just first case.
Speaker 2:Many more use cases are going to come from Africa. But are the global protocols ready to invest? Look at East Denver Millions of dollars here and you don't see anything. Imagine you have half of that money, even just 1% of that money, invested in young people, the ecosystem we are building, that trust network. In just three years we'll see more application and we will now begin to see more human beings using the technology to solve real human problems. So that's one of the reasons why we are passionate about it. It's not just about passion, but it's something that we have seen early signs of success.
Speaker 1:That was amazing. Along those lines, tell me more about younger generations in Africa, in the US, we have a whole different approach to our younger generations. One of the things I studied in political science was the fact that when a younger generation in a nation state doesn't have access to hope or to build their own future, as they see it, they enter into other mechanisms for support and to survive. So that is what I find absolutely fascinating by. What y'all are building is because you're providing that alternative to where, like when I was brought into the space, we were tracking money launderers and a lot of it went back through Nigeria, because that was how the young youth were able to make a living. And so now y'all are able to put this tech in the hands and they can build something like Socrates or build these things that can help create generational wealth, which, in this country, is something we lose.
Speaker 1:We don't understand the value of this tech. It is for the casino only and that is the only use case. Really, that, or money laundering, are the main use cases. Besides, what Base and Coinbase are doing? They're doing good stuff, but it's still gamification. So tell us a little bit more about what this really means to the youth or like a good you know along those lines.
Speaker 2:I'll let Michael take this question. Thanks for putting me on the spot. I think to me there, there, there, three. I love to think in three constructs. That's how I live my life.
Speaker 2:I live my life by the rule of three, and so the number one way to look at this is what makes someone wake up every day and be alive? It's because they hope for something. The moment you take hope away from anybody, they will shrink, just like the way a flower will shrink without the water in the house. And so when I know they have a hope, next day, I'm going to go to bed, no matter how frustrated I am. I'm going to preserve my life because I know that tomorrow I'm going to be a better person. That's the number one construct. The number two construct is I have someone who is creating something that gives me a new belief system, and if I know that my belief system aligns with my purpose, see, it goes away from hope, it goes into what we call value. Right, and the moment I can bring value to the world, the world will respond. The world always responds to value, and that's what makes the guy who goes from I have an idea to oh, I'm actually doing it, but I'm not actually doing it. Oh, I'm actually changing life. Look, I'm not actually changing life. I'm making change happen. And what are the things?
Speaker 2:It goes back to recycle that, what I call the process of hope. And so when you talk about the American young people and the African young people, I will say what we've seen in the last couple of decades in Africa is we have no choice Because we don't have a benefit system that writes us a check in the post. We don't have generational wealth where I can afford to say, oh, I'm not going to work. We have children as young as 10 years old, 15 years old, trying to figure out life. A lot of them don't even understand what childhood means. Their entire childhood is taken away from them. And the reason I'm sharing this context is not to weave up any pity, because that's against our principle of higher. It's to actually begin to let the world see why what we're doing at Hire is going to set we believe will set a whole new global conversation.
Speaker 2:Because when we go back to why blockchain and this is someone that's been in this space since 2014,. When I came into this space in those early years, in those years, the first crypto job description was what we call blockchain evangelist. Any OG will know that, and what was the job of a blockchain evangelist? It's literally going around selling hope. Oh, here, this is blockchain, and this new technology will give you power against the state, who gives you an alternative to where you're living. It makes you make money, yes, of course, but beyond that, it gives us alternative to the existing nation living. It makes you make money, yes, of course, but beyond that, it gives us alternative to the existing nation-state structure.
Speaker 3:Hopium we still talk about it, thank you.
Speaker 2:And when you look into that, that hope is what has powered the Web3 space till this very day, and this space always has created that belief system where, when you see the kind of people who are attracting the Web3 space, we all have one fundamental trait we are rebellious people. And the reason for that is because that hope has created a belief system and that belief system continues to recruit, subconsciously, new followers into that belief system. But what has happened over years is we've lost the fundamentals of that hope, and what we've then years is we've lost the fundamentals of that hope and what we've then done is we've created a new belief system that doesn't align with the fundamentals. And so to me, when I hear things like oh gee, what the fuck is an og part of my french like we, and then the web.
Speaker 3:This is a french friendly podcast. Yeah, thank you yeah, forgive it.
Speaker 2:And then you see, you then have a lot of people who then say oh, we're building. There's so many jargons, there's so many smart and cool people that we even forgot that we're human first before we become smart and cool, like now. He's like oh, I want to get to understand why you're cool and why you're smart, but I don't really give a shit about why you're human. But the fundamentals of Web 3 is literally creating a new hope for human race, and that hope is there is an alternative way of doing things. There's an alternative way that will save us from the existing nation state. And so when you begin to trace that fundamentals, I summarize it with three words.
Speaker 2:Number one is human layer, and that human layer cannot exist or function without human coordination, and that human coordination cannot succeed or create a new belief system without human flourishing. Those are the three key words. And so when you say we're building the human layer, it's like oh, listen, hi, I have a new hope. Oh, I think that hope sounds cool. And then we recruit each other based on the line of hope as a human layer, because the only reason I believe in that hope is because I believe in you. It's the same thing if you see him write checks because he loves that guy, he believes he can walk with that guy Right, and then that human layer then gives us the human coordination and we've missed that anywhere through space.
Speaker 3:I have a follow-up. There's probably no right answer, but how transferable that's? I mean we're going to be good friends.
Speaker 1:We are Because I've got yeah the universe had decided long ago.
Speaker 3:that was the case, but yeah, I just, I mean, I have a I'm a philosopher, probably in some other previous life.
Speaker 3:How much of that's transferable and the optimistic piece that I'm learning through other projects?
Speaker 3:I think we in the West get just into our typical routines and just don't pick our head up enough to understand that this is a global phenomenon and hope is transferable. I think there's things you're referencing that cross all boundaries, cross all, and maybe it's not, because there is something unique obviously about Africa and about that communal nature that goes well back. How much, or what is transferable, like out of what you're seeing, or is it not not, which is also exciting to me, because that means the like hegemony that has represented and we're already seeing I think that is already shifting. There's now sort of this bipolar and but it unfortunately it's become this like us china dynamic, which like obviously the world's bigger. All that is a long way. To just ask you how much you think the IF philosophy whether it's the ideals or the actual you know programs and technology and everything else that is a template that actually does and should cross borders and be useful outside of what you know, has worked and I think it's okay to say it shouldn't.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. I think I'm going to lean more towards the first construct, that is, how much of this is transferable? At the end of the day, I believe that every human, including myself. We are programmable. All humans in this planet, including myself. And for those who have the privilege to work with the human mind and knows how to deconstruct those concepts that mix up our belief system, they know that they can take anything out of your mind and put anything there. That's why we've had the whole likes of mind alteration programs and all these things. People think they're all mad, they're all conspiracy theories, but they're real. That's why we can see people go to an hypnotist and the hypnotist walks you through things and the habit you used to have. You destroy those habits. You form new constructs and so, fundamentally, every human is programmable.
Speaker 2:And the fact that we are programmable, it means there is something that is universal, and number one of that is hope. Because what makes us to come on this table is because we all have a hope for a new Web3. We all have a hope for a new set of human behaviors. We all have a hope for a new Web3. We all have a hope for any set of human behaviors we all have a hope for a new and better world. We all have a hope that maybe someone, one child somewhere in Denver, in Ohio, in Africa, in Kenya, in Nigeria, will listen to the podcast and will have a belief in themselves that the world can be a better place. Right, and why? Would people say they're techno-optimists? Because we believe that technology can make us do better and think better and be better. And so to me it's transpirable, because we all as humans, even as much as our ego, kind of trickles into oh, I'm super smart and I can be the leader. You know what, if sheets are down and we're grabbing the beer? How many human on this planet doesn't feel loneliness? We all do. How many human on this planet doesn't feel hunger? When someone does something that really hurts them? We all feel hurt. How many human doesn't feel love? We all feel loved.
Speaker 2:And so when you look at all these part of us, of us, I think the way that this connect is and makes us think they're not transferable is when we actually forget that we're human. I think that's the what we've seen over the years is and what we believe in the higher tenets and higher philosophy is. Can we just all accept that we're human. If we all can all come to that collective agreement that we're human, then we all will actually realize that we can program ourselves to be anything. We can create a whole new belief system, we can create a whole new movement, and we all can play in that movement and create a lot of good, amazing things for the world from that.
Speaker 2:And so, to me, once we all agree, and collectively, that we are programmable as humans which I strongly believe we are then we all will agree that everything is transferable. What is blocking us from our? It then comes to a place of do I accept, do I reject? Then a place ego. It then comes to a place of do I accept, do I reject? Then a place of acceptance then comes from a place of awareness. Then a place of rejection either comes from fear or from ego. And so, by deconstructing those constructs, that makes us programmable as humans, it makes us realize that actually anything is transferable, as long as we all agree on one basic thing that we're human.
Speaker 2:And so if michael is building ethereum, the humanity me will reflect in the code I'm writing. If I'm building the nest super ai model, the humanity of me will reflect in that model. The humanity of me will reflect in that model If I'm feeding data parameters into that machine learning, the parameters, the prompt I'm giving to that AI is a reflection of my consciousness and my intelligence, and that other intelligence will make that back to me, because we're programming each other. And so, to me, I strongly believe that once we come to a place of we're all human, then we can actually come to a place of we're all human. Then we can actually come to a place of what does it take to be a human? And what I strongly believe it takes to be a human is those three constructs.
Speaker 2:I'm waking up tomorrow because I believe there's a better tomorrow. There's hope, and that hope makes me want to trick myself to love and be vulnerable, and that tricks me to want to believe that I can make a change in the world. Then it becomes a power that makes me want to bring something to the world, and that, for us, is the higher philosophy it's less forget about. And we come to a pre-event just like I've done this over years where I go to a pre-event and people say the first question, where are? First question where you from? Oh, what project you work for? And I have this very silly thing I do and I hope one day someone's not gonna punch me in the face right and I get into oh, I'm just Michael, and I'm sure Eric will be laughing here in this. Now. I'm just Michael like no, no, no, no, what do you do?
Speaker 3:I'm just Michael and what I've seen and I no what do you do?
Speaker 2:I'm just Michael, and what I've seen and I've done this for the last 10 years people go into two minutes of brain freeze, People literally staring at you for two minutes and say nothing. And if you don't believe Matrix is real, that doesn't mean that I personally think shit. I think Matrix is real. If that's me literally saying who are you? And to that guy he's like no, I'm the Coinbase I'm building, I'm the Arbitrum I'm building, I'm the Ethereum I'm building. They totally completely forget who they are. And so when you see people that say one day machine will run over us, there is a bit of truth in that, because we have totally forgotten we're human and if we cannot humanize whatever we're building or whatever we're controlling, that thing has to decide to control us, and I hope I answered your question. For us at AYA, it's human first and the tenets that makes us human is the collective hope we all share, the collective love and the vulnerabilities we all share together and the change we're collectively agreed I want to bring to the world.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think you answered it.
Speaker 1:I would say so.
Speaker 3:I love that. I'm going to. I promise you I will go and test this out. I'm Taylor, I'm a human and that's it. I will, literally. Yeah, it's going to happen. You're going to do that today and you're going to literally see that truly, we live in the matrix, but it opens the door to such a meaningful conversation and everyone has that capacity and most people want to go to that space anyway. That is correct. Like it feels good when you get there. That's correct. Let go of this for a second. I get it. We're here, you've invested money and time and sure. But the minute you start there, it's like, yeah, it opens up a much broader window. That's great. That's where the real magic happens. Yeah, yeah, Amazing.
Speaker 1:So at DEF CON this year, there was a strong African presence, which I thought was just beautiful, and, eric, you got to emcee and there was just a whole group of African builders that were able to travel and to come and meet in person. How did that feel for you and what was the takeaways for the African builders when they went home? Like, was the momentum able to keep going? Do they need more resources? Did they all come to the hacker houses now and build with you? Like, how was that for you? I mean, I thought it was amazing to see.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So on the flip side, it's a big win for the ecosystem, because Michael says something which is accepting or rejecting. You accept something that is familiar to you and you know you reject something on two key bases I don't know, I don't know, I don't trust. And so one thing is now people now begin to see oh, in DEF CON, for the first time there are about 50-plus Africans able to travel, get visa to travel and be in the same environment. Then you have the EAF, which is the organizer of DEF CON, in the same environment. Then you have the EF, which is the organizer of DEF CON. The entire leadership set up African Day with the EF executive. Come, engage, interact and share ideas. It's one of the pieces which is good for the ecosystem. The trust is being built, built and it's increasing. The more trust is built around the African builder, the easier it is for decisions to be made in the interest of the ecosystem.
Speaker 2:Because for me it's not about, oh, we need to give them support or we need to give them grant or invest. No, it's not about that. It's about every dollar you spend, the effects or the ROI on your protocol that you are building, but you're not giving me charity. I mean, I don't believe in charity. I don't believe in just give me free things. I believe in meritocracy because I believe that you, in just giving free things, I believe in meritocracy Because I believe that you need to earn your space and in that space, devcon, for me, was an opportunity for the global ecosystem to actually reflect and see the injustice that we've all done to ourselves.
Speaker 2:For Ethereum it's 10 years, for Ethereum is 10 years, and not in Ethereum history has ever done any Ethereum phase activity in a continent that has 1.4 billion people and you cannot say, oh, they are right. It's true, because you don't have any data to show Ethereum. We don't just come to Africa. We want to do something. We need to see that people are actually doing something, and so it gave two key things for African people that, oh, it's possible for me to also be a global platform. It's also true that if we don't actually build something, we are just a number in the scheme of things. And so what we have seen it happen that, yes, from Zuzalu, we said, oh, we need to invest in physical space where you can have people come together, and that first one done in Accra. We've seen more than seven projects launched from that hub. So when you talk of Haka House in this part of the world, it's four days, five days. No, the Ayab Builder Hub is a permanent space where random conversations happen and the world, most of the magic that has happened in this world is through random conversations, conversations that you don't plan and you go. Oh, then you go back, ah that thing, you go and work on it. So in seven months we've seen over seven projects built in the IA Hub. We've seen people come. They didn they even know that it's possible. They come, there's free internet, there's free electricity and you just get your laptop and you're doing something. That approach has yielded measurable results and today, lakes in the past have said, oh, this is actually working. Then they invest in another one in Kenya. They have a second hub in Kenya. By the end of the year we'll have two more hubs in two countries South Africa and Nigeria.
Speaker 2:The goal for this is that we need to kind of double down and empower local builders to actually solve local problems with solutions on the blockchain and for us to build Ethereum to the next stage I aim to have a billionereum. To the next stage, where it turns, I aim to have a billion users in the next 10 years across the frontier markets. Vitalik is turned bullish on the argentina because argentina is sexy. Vitalik is bullish in argentina because he has seen that technology is working in argentina and that's the. That's the goal.
Speaker 2:So for us at aya, our goal is very simple that DEF CON opens up the door Now. It shows that real human beings in Africa that are doing some few things that is real, you can measure. We've seen that impact on growth strategy having builder spaces. Builder I mean summits. We've seen StackNet announce a $4 million fund to invest in early stage builders. For us this is early stage confirmation that when people are aware they know it's easy for them to make decisions that influences an ecosystem.
Speaker 2:So the gap of rejecting reduces because there's trust. Without our trust there's no way folks will invest in the continent. Five years ago nobody was good in Argentina, but today almost everybody is putting real money in Argentina because folks are beginning to see that guys are building solutions that are bringing real human beings, not bots. So it's a matter of time for us to begin to see real impact of this kind of activities or this kind of intervention that we are putting in and it's purely based on our own stubborn mission, because if it's about the resources, we would have stopped this thing. But we believe that we need to continue to show the world, prove that this technology is not just gathering people together and having beer.
Speaker 2:This technology yes, the casino needs to run, because we need the casino for the ecosystem to run. But beyond the casino, how do we really really think through how this technology will really serve people's everyday needs? Like sarcasm, now people are predicting peer-to-peer gaming is going on. How do you solve it? You are building a stablecoin platform that enables business to convert their local currencies, which has lost about 60% in the last three years. In Ghana, for example, the city has lost about 60% of its value to the US dollar. How do you enable a small business to convert their income into stable?
Speaker 2:coin and hold it until they need it and come back so they don't lose their cash flow. These are real solutions that people are building and it's just a matter of time. And just for me to add, trust is a currency and for us at AYA, we are not here to tell you that come to Africa, because Africa is sexy. It's not sexy. You need to be part of building the infrastructure that will make it sexier. But in Denver four or five years ago it was not sexy. Few people have to put in efforts to make it become much more like oh, this is what you need to be. Africa is not sexy. You are waiting for it to be sexy. Then you're not going to see the sexiness until you get to the arena, touch grass together and then invest in the potential, because without investing in the potential there's no reality. And we all continue to kind of invest. Silicon Valley was the same thing. People have to invest in the potential. We have to see the Google, the Apple In 10 years from now.
Speaker 2:Real solutions that will solve real human beings will come from Africa and South America. This is the right time to enter the African ecosystem and connect with ecosystems that have built that trust. But trust is the only thing that makes people move. Trust is the only thing that makes people open their doors. Without trust, we cannot have this conversation, and without hope there's no way that we can say, oh, tomorrow it's going to rain. Hope is what fuels our movement, but trust is the most important denominator that makes people to say, oh, I can work with you From now to when I see that there's work to be more.
Speaker 2:So my last compliment is that AYA mission is not something that is fun to do. It's hard work. But we have a team that wake up every day saying that if we don't do this, who will do it? Because Cristea is not going to do it for us in Africa. Cristea can only amplify it. But we have to solve the problem, build it ourselves, create the value to enable it to become more attractive. But at the end of the day, money is not free. Nobody gives money for free. We need to give money out so the money can come in again and redistribute it back again, and so we are not building something that oh, charity, no, it's business. There's money to be made, but somebody has to do their legwork so that together that money can achieve significant outcome that can be visible for the world to see, and I will say that we are excited about the future we are building the physical spaces is showing us what is possible in the next five years, because already I mean one year, one year the result is phenomenal.
Speaker 2:You see people talking about it on their own, without you. You tell, oh, please talk about us. No, we don't do that. Everybody you see tweet about AYA. Their experience is what they are feeling in their own lives and the mindset for us is the fundamental for us, because America and Europe, part of Asia, they have done over and over again. It's so new Us.
Speaker 2:We need to build the block of opening people's minds to see possibilities, and that's what Mike talked about hope. But when people know that it's possible, their voice, their dream is valid, then they can wake up every day, try to work on it, knowing that, oh, I don't need to think about what I will eat. There's already something for me to eat. All I need to do is continue to show proof of my dream and people now support that dream to become bigger. Because we need everybody, we need allies who believe in us. We need allies for us to create economic power, and that economic power is what incentivizes VCs protocols to actually put millions of dollars, not thousands, Because I think that a thousand is okay, a thousand is worth, but it cannot go to the next stage unless millions come into the ecosystem.
Speaker 1:Oh, that was such a good answer. We got time, taylor.
Speaker 3:No, it's. Yeah. I can sit and do this for days and days and often just talking like like can be draining. This is like such an inversion and I feel energized just listening, and it's also the part I love Speaking of inversion it's the.
Speaker 3:It's the very real people in the real communities. The majority of projects that come through Web3, that doesn't. That's not how it starts. It's the virtual first. It's it's the very real people in the real communities. The majority of projects that come through Web3, that's not how it starts. It's the virtual first. It's the meme coin, it's the network and eventually, hopefully yeah, okay, now I can point to that thing that changed Bits and atoms comes up, I think, more and more, but it's like you guys started with the atoms and you realize that the bits are important and the digital is important, but because you're grounded in a deep mission and hope and that being the foundational layer that you've tied to humans and letting that be the foundation, I'm just like man. There's a lot to learn and I hope we can keep pointing out where that doesn't happen. That isn't the case, and it's often not the case in a lot of crypto and Web3 projects. So good job, it's fun, it's exciting. You got advocates.
Speaker 1:And I love too, michael, the way you say you're building your own digital garden. I love that Both of you are like yeah, we got it, we're going to build our thing.
Speaker 2:I think that's amazing. People need to hear more of that. Absolutely, krista. I think I've come to a conclusion and maybe that will change things from now. But one thing I do strongly believe is our beliefs lift and power us alive, and it's not my job to go change what someone believes. It's not my job to go tell someone you need to like me. It's not my job to go tell someone you need to like me. It's not my job to go tell someone, oh, you need to come to Africa. That's not my job. My job is to tell them why there is value in Africa. My job is to show to them, through AYA, where there is such a lot of money to be made in Africa. My job, together with AYA, is to show them why what we're doing at AYA is not just for Africa but for the entire Web3 industry.
Speaker 2:At the end of the day, a lot of folks who have built wealth in this space, there are folks in this space like 15 years ago. No one knows anything about them. They're literally like as broke as anything, and today they can go on a global stage and have influence and talk to president and of countries because the Web3 has made them billionaire, because we've created a new over-financialization industry that has made us also print money out of tin here that have now redistributed wealth from the traditional market into the hands of crypto-brows, and so these crypto-brows also need to understand that if I don't continue the same way, the traditional money will lay down its life to preserve the American stock exchange and Japan stock exchange and those global stock exchanges and make sure there is liquidity decks and BlackRock and JP Morgan. The way they have intention about keeping the money infrastructure in the traditional world going is the same way that crypto bros need to really, really get serious to keep that infrastructure going, and we've seen that. When Trump coin and melanin coin was launched, the crypto bros thought they were immutable. They weren't, because all of a sudden, liquidity is to get sucked out of the entire ecosystem, and all of them felt it, and so what has that shown to us as an industry is, in reality, we've built this ecosystem, but we've not actually figured out how to actually build a solid ecosystem that is totally independent and decentralized solid ecosystem that is totally independent and decentralized, and so every of these crypto broads what we call the OGs in this space, we're sitting on millions and millions of tokens of dollars today, which to me, tomorrow can go to zero. They need to realize that we're actually here to help them. Right, and to me it's a very hard pill to swallow, but we're actually here to help them Because the more utility we create in this space it's like the way the VC is incentivized to go find the next biggest startup so that it can go list on the New York Stock Exchange that's what we're doing for them here. We're helping them create that more value utility so that the entire industry can begin to become more robust and more powerful and so that the perception about industry begins to change from over-financialization to actual, real-world utility. That's why it's called utility token in the first place. And so to then come to that in terms of creating our own garden is I'm personally done trying to validate someone's kind of low ego.
Speaker 2:I'm done with that. I'm done trying to make some crypto bro who never has any job in their life or any real world experience, who all he knows is he has a bunch of privilege and he launches token and he has a couple of friends who are market makers who kind of inflated our token and kind of buy low and dump on the rest of the TG in the public sales and that guy thinks he's super smart. No, you're not super smart. Come to Africa, let me give you $10,000, run an SME, and if you're still standing after three years, then I know you're smart. So I'm done trying to validate the ego for them, because what would then happen here is because there's a lot of insecurities among our crypto bros. Right, there's a lot of insecurity, and that is coming from what I called not being allowed themselves to be vulnerable, because they themselves are not really sure about what industry is, and that lack of insecurity is reflecting on the entire industry.
Speaker 2:Where we then go, the only thing we talk about is how much you've raised, what you're building, who you are, and then when they see an African builder or they see a black builder, straight away they go into oh, this is time for me to dump my ego right. Wake up, bros, crypto bros. You gotta wake up, because this is michael and I'm telling you there are new set of builders here. We don't really give a shit about your ego, and so that's where that mindset is coming from. In times of we are building our own garden, the butterflies will love the smell of our flowers and how beautiful our garden looks like, they will fly in and we'll start seeing that there's an amazing ally, a lady in OP called Maureen. We just left Maureen now. Maureen is an amazing human in this space who helped us with introductions. Without Maureen, the the least conversation would not happen. Eric invited Maureen to Africa about two years ago. She left. She wrote her report to OP. As a result of that, op funded a lot of ecosystems.
Speaker 2:I'm very grateful to these folks. You see, to me that's the power of human labor, that's the power of creating our own garden and that's the reason, you see that the t-shirts we're wearing in East Denver this year is actually quite provocative. It's a bold statement. My back is saying if you give a middle finger about African builders, give me a tap on my shoulder. I'm not going to come talk to you, but if you truly give a middle finger about African builders, I'm ready to talk to you and my front say if you're writing checks for African deploying capital to African founders, give me a hug. And that's not me saying those who are not deploying capital are less of a human, but that's just me saying I'm not ready to validate your ego. We're done doing that and we're breeding a new set of builders on the continent who are as high breed as we are, because my job in higher I create the vibe and the culture and the spiritual mind. That's my job at hire and this set of new builders.
Speaker 2:They're not going to come. You're not going to see them at Endeavor trying to chase for pictures. No, we don't do that anymore. There's no celebrity here. Everyone is benefiting from this industry, from this garden. There's an infinity garden that we all, as butterflies, are feeding from the nectars and, as we all do, water that garden as a collective. There will not be any nectar for us to feed us on it, so there will not be pollination. What we're saying is we're creating an alternative garden where, if you believe you need to cross-pollinate, you're welcome. But what we're not going to do is for us to keep trying to survive in that little garden that we've created for ourselves and feel little small in it, when actually we're the global majority.
Speaker 2:Africa today is bigger than the rest of the world in terms of land mass. I'll just give you a lie America, china and India combined in terms of land mass, africa is bigger. One in five persons you're going to see by 2050 is going to look like Michael and Eric. So if you truly want to be a human, that is, want to be part of the future, you've got to be intentional to understand these people. You've got to be intentional to understand the culture. You've got to be intentional to play with your resources with these people.
Speaker 2:Why is Jack Dawes in Ghana Now? Jack Dawes doesn't give a shit about Ghana people. His data is showing him before he left Twitter. That's where the future is going and that's why he's there. His dog has been in Ghana for the last two years. So when you look at that, if Jack Dawes can do that in the Bitcoin space, in the Ethereum space, we need to wake up. The crypto bros need to wake up because the liquidity is there. The millions and millions of dollars are there. The problem is, folks are not ready to pop their bubbles and I'm saying this to help them pop their bubbles. And if you really want to grab a coffee and have a human conversation, come to Aya. We're here Because we're creating an alternative garden, because we believe the existing garden can have all the money in the world, but the humans are getting tired.
Speaker 2:There's Eden for this year, the Eden for this year. We're all here looking at people. People look tired. Go have conversation. People are looking tired. What that tells me in that infinity garden is the flowers are shrinking, the petals are falling off, and so that doesn't mean the garden is not there. The garden is still there. It just means what makes that garden beautiful is going, and if we truly all want to allow the source of life, which is the honeybees that we all are, we have to cross-pollinate. We can't just stay in one garden and say we're going to survive and so that's where we come in.
Speaker 2:That's the concept of we're done trying to validate other people's ego, crypto bra's ego. We've done that. We go to global conferences, right? Eric is the guy that will talk to everybody. He's a great guy. I love him. He's a great guy. He's going to talk to everybody. And I remember when he said, michael, I need you to join us as a hire. I said number one rule is promise me you're not going to talk to everybody, because these guys you have a great intention they're just there to talk to another black founder from Africa, and that's not doing us any good. And so, christa, that's where that concept is coming from.
Speaker 2:For the betterment, we believe that people want different. People are getting tired. People are getting tired of the bullshit. Whether we accept it or not, is the truth. If I sit down today with all the billionaires that made billions in our space today and we all get high on some psychedelics and say tell me, aren't you tired? They will cry like baby and say, yeah, michael, we're tired, and that's the truth.
Speaker 2:Then the question is what are we going to do about it? And what we're saying is we're not asking for too much. Can you give us? Eat Denver this year, eat Sisi, all these events? You all go to spend millions of dollars printing t-shirts that people are going to end up dumping, they're never going to wear. Can we get 1% of this to actually create what matters? We're not asking for too much. It's like test us with $10 million, test us with $20 million. Come back in five years. Come see the result. Lisk is an example. Lisk is only giving us less than half a million. The result in eight months is out of the roof. They say the TV is going. No one knows Lisk in Africa six months ago. Everyone knows Lisk now in Africa, so those are real.
Speaker 2:This is not just talking rhetoric. They're data that backs it up. That validates the growth in six months with little or no resources. We have projects we're only raising $20,000 and they're profitable, they are revenue, and we have projects in this space that have raised tens of tons of millions of dollars. They're not even talking about revenue.
Speaker 2:So if you truly want to be here 20 years from now, we need to start having those hard conversations, and so our garden is a place where those bees who want to be here for longer, who wants to come to our garden, because we have no bullshit conversation, we have hard conversations. We have human-rooted conversation that is rooted in conviction and philosophy and love and acceptance, and that's what that is, and right now, we don't have that in this present garden. This present garden is so full of Ahinas. You know, ahinas. What I love about Ahinas is Ahinas thinks they're lions, but they're not actually lions. And because they're not lions, they're so toxic and so pissed off that their backs like lion, but they're not lion.
Speaker 2:And so what we've created now? We've created a jungle instead of a garden, and so what we're saying is for us to continue to grow as an industry. We need a garden, we don't need a jungle. We don't need a place where we all prey on each other. We need a place where we all prey on each other. We need a place where we all cross-pollinate and coexist as a collective of humans, and that, to us, is a new message for the entire industry.
Speaker 2:The higher conversation is not just an Africa conversation, and that's why I told Eric I joined AI, because I believe the entire industry and as someone that's been here since 2014, it's Eric that brought me on the surface. I don't think there's anyone in this space and I say it authoritatively that can't look into their face and say let's face it, we fucked it up and we need to go back to the fundamentals so that we all don't become irrelevant. 20, 15 years from now. We'll all have the billions. Don't get me wrong. Those financial incentivizations will still be there, but we'll hate ourselves for it, and the only way we'll keep trying to cover for it will be psychedelics, and I don't think we're going to mushroom our way out of this.
Speaker 1:Damn. I don't have anything to add to that. We're almost out of time, but that was, and I think this is what I love about working with y'all, even though we haven't gotten to work. Work, you know. Whatever you call work is your power and conviction and your energy. That is exactly everything you just said is exactly what this ecosystem and industry needs. They need to have a come to Jesus. They need to look deep and see what is the fucking point.
Speaker 2:Absolutely 100%.
Speaker 3:Come to Jesus, Jesus come to mushrooms. Whatever that unlock is, we need something that's more significant than Absolutely Thank you for all that, absolutely Thank you.
Speaker 2:And just to wrap it up, there's a joke I made on Twitter the other day. I said one of the things I've seen in the Web3 space I'm a philosopher. We all love mushrooms so much. The mushroom gets you quite philosophical, but it doesn't actually get you, knocks you off to your vulnerability. When you're a mushroom you're not actually not vulnerable. You get very philosophical, so you still make your ego still there. But when you kind of go on some kind of iboga, so you still make your ego still there. But when you kind of go on some kind of Iboga, some kind of Ayahuasca, you know you start pouring and shitting yourself and you're like, oh, what the fuck just hit me right. And so I said maybe we should actually have an E-Denver where we all kind of go in the Peru jungle and have Ayahuasca, and then the second day we have a conversation.
Speaker 1:Maybe that will help us. That's just right now there, you know, I just had a visual of all the ways that that could go. I'm here for it, I think so we're probably at the end of time here. Eric, I want to give you the mic one more time. Is there anything you want to add? And then Taylor, you as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. So in April we put together the Human Flourishing Coordinating Experience in Africa, or ZooAfric. So we piloted something last year called Muakra with folks from the Mu team and that was the first pop-up experience in Africa where 120 young people from four countries in Africa came together for two weeks and what we saw Moacra do to today is still the standard. People are still talking about the experience, the mention of deep level of conversation and mindset shift. We are putting Zoo Africa together. It's going to happen in Kenya, a beautiful coastal city called Kilifi. It's a to happen in Kenya, a beautiful coastal city called Kilifi. It's a 21 days pop-up experience. Taylor, I want to invite you there. You need to be there Once. We've realized that we can't pitch Africa on a pitch deck. I, for the last four years, been in places like Zuzalo Istanbul. I've been on a stage, zuzalo Istanbul, and been on the stage. Thank you, christa, for giving me that stage in Istanbul, the Hyperlink. What I've realized is that people just oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. They get excited about conference and then they go back and everything just wipes off. We cannot tell you convention of Africa. You need to experience Africa to know that it's not just about the numbers. It's about the future that we all try to create and shape a perspective, and so Zoo Africa is going to do two things. For you, it's like a holiday for you where you just come and experience a different culture. But beyond that, let's have real conversation to safeguard, protect, secure this future that we are creating. Because in as much as we feel like people feel, oh, we are building cool talk today I've had three conversations oh, we're building this technology, aggregating, it's all code. Can we just look at the code as code and see human beings as human beings and look at how the intersection of the code and human beings and we believe that Zoo Africa will provide that context for most global protocols to begin to see oh, I have this beautiful technology, but I've not looked at it from a way of solving real people's problems. And as someone that I believe in the ground up, because my background is micro approach, I don't believe in macro until the micro makes sense to me, because you cannot talk about. That's a similar approach that World Bank, the IMF, have done to emerging markets that are still struggling Because they paint a picture of macro. Oh, we're solving, we've changed one million people's lives. If you dig into it, nothing can be found. But the approach of the macro crown up. It gives you real, measurable outcomes and that's what we've seen in the higher approach. We are not the big numbers, people, but our micro numbers give you the big numbers. That's what lays its benefits from today. That's what provided more accra, our final program. If you check out our social, you see founders talking about how they felt and how that is shaping the way they are even looking at how they are building their own projects. Now. Some of them will be exiting in five, ten years from now and you begin to see where it started from. It needs to have a micro connection.
Speaker 2:Zoo Africa is an open invitation to every global protocol willing to explore an alternative from the last 10 years. You've been in Denver for the last 4, 5 years. Come see something different. Let's have a real conversation. It's 3 weeks. You don't need to be there for 3 weeks. You can be there for 7 days. You can be there for 5 days.
Speaker 2:But the point is that if you spend 24 hours in zoo Africa, your mindset will shift, and to shift to impact the way you build this technology. To shift from the way you see just the numbers on the screen, to how to work on the numbers on the screen, to real human beings who use this technology as daily activity, as a daily implementation life plan. This is just screen and boats, farming, all those things. I believe technology is great. It will do a lot more for humanity than we have seen all the tech startups done. But until we actually talk to the people that really, really need it, I think we're still in the face of playing around it and experimenting.
Speaker 2:But how long do we have to experiment? Face of playing around it and experimenting, but how long do we have to experiment? We need to get really serious now so that I think we have the best time now in the last four years in this administration, especially in the US. But the US still is the commander, it's the leader in the world. However, the US do affect the global conversation. This is the right time for this administration being pro-crypto. If we don't get it right now, I don't know when this industry will get right. So this is the right time to get out of our comfort zone and go to places where we can actually prove that this technology is actually more than the token. And that's our word and that's our message. Thank you for giving us the opportunity to be on this show. We look forward to this conversation, because this is just the beginning of this conversation. Yes, and we have more of this to actually shape the way people look at the technology beyond the token.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, absolutely. And focusing on that human layer that y'all are building. I mean, you, you're just doing it. Thank you all, both so much for joining us. And yeah, taylor.
Speaker 3:No, grateful. Thank you for the invitation. Zooafrique, I mean this. Yeah, exciting to know that there are. I think there's a recognition that things are changing and Africa represents something important. I mean, this would be a good call out even to the resources that exist both at East Denver but elsewhere. We do a lot to say how do we get people here to make sure they can experience it? You've proven that you really want to make an impact and you want to be able to show the metrics of we're changing the world. Sponsor people to go to Zoo F3. Sponsor people to go where they can make, make a difference and, like, really change the mindset, like you're saying. So, yeah, it's exciting. Appreciate you guys both for being here, Grateful.
Speaker 2:Very grateful.
Speaker 3:Thank you for having us.
